senior officer Mikael van Atta

Well, this is why a hand taser is one of the weapons 8-Ball carries around (for this gig, he also carries two large handguns - the Nova Arno revolver and the Aramaite 44. Nova is more for the psychological impact, so if he cannot get away with wearing both in a certain outfit, that's the one he'll skip on). 

Sure we can beat the living shit out of a troublemaker, but given our skills, it is not unlikely that 1. it will take a while, and 2. it will leave a dead or seriously wounded troublemaker on the floor. Neither of these is a preferred course of events for a gig security job. I believe that having a given troublemaker quickly zapped and handed over to local security (let them hand him/her over to police, or put in their local drunk tank equivalent for the duration - whatever they do with troublemakers. We're on their turf after all!) would be reflecting way better on us (also, apart from a mjor discomfort, the target is likely to be basically unharmed). 

If asked, 8-Ball would suggest Cossack (and the rest of the team's security personnel) to get ahold of contact tasers (be it Militech Taser 2, Dynatech Hand Tasers or Techtronica Black-Zap gloves - they all cost between 50 and 100eb, and can be recharged from a wall socket. All are P-concealable. I like the Excalibur nightstick, but it is kinda difficult to carry around...). I guess Cossack would like the Black-Zap best of these, as it can be used with (martial-arts) punches and grabs.

6 hours ago, Allen1 said:

8-Ball's knowledge of general gang culture will be a great asset here.  The Heartthrobs is a poser band and posers can take any criticism of their 'character' badly and may react violently.  This group has a rep of being fairly reasonable. 

Plus, he is actually aware of the (RL) Glenn Miller and Katharine Hepburn (I decided against Gene Krupa: I get he was an important contributor to the era, but wasn't, I think, that well known in the context of WW2, while Miller was in the AAF band and performing for the troops in Europe). He's unfamiliar with the rest of them (but unless Frankie turns out to be an asshole, he's going to absolutely love Frank Sinatra once he learns of him). 

After all, 8-Ball's knowledge of the 20th century is... pretty specific

3 hours ago, TigerGuard said:

Cossack will strongly disagree with the idea of switching from a 2x2 to a 1x2x1 as the outriders job is better performed by the drones and cutting our combat effectiveness in half could prove detrimental.  Mitzi and Hollow will be unable to return fire while maintaining convoy coherency since they'd actually have to stop, and possibly dismount, in order to be combat effective.  I don't expect my concerns to be considered since we're only facing some minor acts of sabotage or harassment by a couple of down-on-their-luck punks... easiest 25k we've ever pocketed

Seconded by 8-Ball. 

As for weather - from my IRL practice, absolutely handleable without a tent.As usual, the most unpleasant moment is getting out of your warm sleeping bag in the morning... but I guess for our bunch of city slickers it is going to be a couple of difficult days anyway.

• Two-man tents, I guess, then.
• Adequate sleeping bags,
• sleeping mats,
• maybe an inflatable pillow if someone needs that.
• Warm clothes for watch duty - thermal underwear, loft-type jackets (and maybe trousers) or poncho liners. Exact composition depends on actual weather, and one's cold tolerance (eg. I expect 8-Ball to be pretty comfortable in low temperature, given his ample Endurance base. Angel's gonna be way less happy).

We might want to hit an army / navy surplus store in Night City for these: won't win no fashion contest, but it will be warm, practical, durable... and, being surplus, on a budget. Alternatively, we can visit any decent sports / camping / hiking store - I expect one to be present at any major mall, right? - and get the same stuff, just in a modern, more fashionable issue. Plus, it will be fresh rather than used - some folks may have an issue with second-hand stuff.  

@Allen1, it would be handy to have the expected costs for these sets pre-calculated. In both surplus and tourist store versions.

As for food... hauling a microwave around is going to be a hassle - it needs a lot of electricity, preferably a wall-socket grade energy source:

• bring a portable generator along. Not a bad idea, as we'll need a relaible power source to charge some other stuff, starting with cellphones, I guess.
• have Angel whip up a power converter to give us enough juice off the van's electrical system. This is problematic, as I don't expect the car to have extra batteries to handle that (it wasn't buildt as a camper). I'm pretty sure hAngel's capable of doing that.
• Find a way to circumvent the need for a microwave. Either get some prepack that doesn't have to be microwaved (self-heating, or "just add hot water"). Get a camping stove (well, given how many people we're deploying, two or three of these), probably a multifuel or spirit burner (in fact, Angel could easily whip up a dozen "pop-can stoves" from empty drink cans in an hour - provided somebody told him how does a "pop-can stove" look like. These aren't terribly effective, but we don't expect to be in a hurry. And they work on basially any flammable liquid, so we could run them off CHOOH2 the vehicles use, too).

Updating as per the campaign data: each chapter chooses their "theme" separately. At this moment, we have 3 chapters estabilished:

• Night City: Vietnam War
• Seattle: WW2 (Western European theatre)
• Los Angeles: WW2 (Pacific theatre).

So far, all the gangers were US Armed Forces reenactors, although one of the NC chapter members - of Asian descend - might be pulling a South Vietnamese reenaction (I haven't paid much attention to this).

Individual chapters consider themselves members of the same organization, and would help each other - if they had the means. 

Also, despite what I originally wrote, they don't shy away firearms - they are adequately armed, if they can afford it. They do like period-appropriate firearms, but don't allow that preference to stop them from being reasonable about their choices. Because parade is parade, and street life is a completely different thing.

Well, damn. Looks like it will be tents after all, then. 8-Ball is not that well-versed in wilderness survival (and I'm not at all familiar with conditions in California & Nevada in late December / early January, especially in 2070s) to do without one. Even with his high endurance base.

Angel likely has not been out camping ever in his life.

Otherwise I would say - a decent sleeping bag (adequate to the expected weather), a mat under it, and a bivvy, and we're good...

A question for Mitzi: could she check with the palces the tour is staying about lodging us too? Possibility and costs. As I said, staying in tents or the like is not a good idea, from an organizational point of view.

Another question at logistics: what are our options for taking our food with us? Especially money-wise. 

Food poisoning looks like an excellent option for any competition trying to disrupt the tour: just pay a cook (or have your own man) to add a little special to it. Boom, half the bands members (depending on the amount consumed and individual resilience) are unable to perform, because they're too busy occupying all the toilets available. Nothing fatal, if there's a competent doctor or a pharmacist around, not even something serious, but it ruins Universal Records's plan pretty well. 

We can't avoid getting the bands being had in that way (not enough resources to watch over the fod preparation and delivery), but bringing our own food would at least keep us reasonably safe from being affected.

Well, in that case the Bermuda is staying in Night City, and we don't need a motorcycle rack on the van. Simply put, Bermuda - being a trike - is somewhat too wide and generally too big for that, IMO. Though, I guess, 8-Ball will throw his folding microbike into the van, just in case. Being small and packable, it shouldn't take a noticeable amount of cargo space, right?

As for roof hatch firing - we need to make sure there is something to stand on. Some kind of pedestal below the hatch. For short time use, the seats themselves will do. If Fawkes expects to be sitting there for extended periods of time, a sling or three can be arranged to provide him a seat and backrest - mounting these to the roof below the hatch should be easy. However, there is no way to quickly and easily make it into a proper gunner's station: the seat won't be able to rotate, Fawkec could seat there facing backwards (or forwards), and that's about it. Won't be very comfortable, either. 

Building any sensible bracket for stabilising the M-90 on the roof is going to be a problem, as it would be either a pintle mount (limiting the gun to a single arc of fire, and rather narrow one in that specific case), or require a total rebuildt of the hatch to make it into a ring mount (like those used on military vehicles). 

Sticking your head out of a speeding van for an extended period of time is not something I'd consider good for one's health, either (though if the head is in a Mk. 88 helmet or equivalent, it is less of an issue).

My suggestion is to sit inside of the van, and stick out only if there's a need for that. Should you be forced to shoot out of it, use it as-is, and just hope ofr the best. 

In either case, Angel will see to giving the top gunner an adequate pedestal to stad on. 

Giving the helmets an external power source is... complicated.

Yes, of course, allowing them to be powered form the car's electrical system is doable (12v car standard installation, right?), probably via the cigarette lighter socket. The problem is you'll have electric wiring hanging around, linking all the helmets to the lighter socket. Moving inside the van will be a hassle, and dismounting will require taking the helmets off.

Adding a wearable battery box is the other solution, and again - could be done. Keep in mind the battery isn't going to keep up for 10 days. So we need it to be small enough to be not a problem to carry (you don't want a car battery on your belt just to power the helmet), and powerful enough to work for a reasonable period of time.

1 hour ago, Allen1 said:

Yes, Angel has the skill to build a carrier, but the question would be does he have the knowledge to do it.  One of the problems with Angel is he has no vehicle skills, so he has no basis to know how to build it.     

Seriously?

You need vehicle skills to make a shelf and frame to hold a piece of equipment? He couldn't build a rifle rack (should we decide to put one in the van) without knowing how to shoot a rifle, by this logic. 

Nope, man, not buying that. It is a problem of having a 100kg piece of equipment (sure, shaped in a rather irregular way) secured to another, larger piece of equipment. With the caveats that other piece of equipment will be moving, so we're talking about a dynamic stress, and that we want our 100kg piece to be relatively easy to unload off its transport frame once we want it off. Oh, said piece of equipment has wheels. And we don't require any fancy power-assist removing it, just one or two people using their muscles.  

8-Ball has concerns about having Mitzi riding the Bermuda together with him on this gig. If the deployment turns out to be 8-Ball riding in a different vehicle, and Mitzi (or any other member of the "old team". As mentioned before, he doesn't have as much confidence in the "new team" members) driving the Bermuda, he's OK with that. Yes, it is his personalized (given the paintjob!) ride, but he's not so emotionally attached to it. Should it get wrecked, it is just a matter of having money to replace it.

Whom Mitzi will take to ride in the "bitch seat" as she colourfully describes it, well, 8-Ball doesn't give a damn  His only concern was having Mitzi and himself in on the same bike (whichever it turned out to be) in case it gets knocked out. 

Yes, 8-Ball can match Hollow's base of 14 in Heavy Weapons. He also doesn't mind riding as Cossack's gunner on the GevHog. 

As for Angel (well yes, his place is in the van, definitely), that's more a question to you, @Allen1: can he build a carrier for the Long Rider (if he can, and he's asked to do it - no problem, he'll do it)? Alternatively, we could take a light trailer, if there's a towing hook on the van. You're right - stowing the bike inside would take most of the usable space. 

So far, deployment seems to unfold like that:

• outrider, GevHog: Cossack (driver), 8-Ball (observer / gunner). There are two free seats should we need flexibility (eg. detach a vehicle and some specialists for some specific task)
• outrider, Bermuda: Mitzi (driver), plus one (observer). I'd suggest Hollow (unless he has issues with riding with Mitzi as a passenger).
• rearguard, van: Rue & Jamal (they may alternate as drivers as they see fit. Rue however, has an idea how to use the RPG that is going to be stowed in the van), Angel (purely as passenger). This would leave Fawkes as the 4th man on the van - which is good IMO, as the van would do good havign a dedicated security operative riding it (is Fawkes qualified on the RPG?). It would be advantageous to have someone keeping an eye on the road behind the convoy (a dedicated rear observer. The driver has enough to do driving the last vehicle of a convoy - having them observe the road behind by rear mirrors is too much of a hassle. Especially given we have the eyes to spare on that).

This setup gives us an alternate driver on each vehicle, should the primary one be put out of action. 

As for taking the job in general: I say we take it. Not for the money (because it isn't spectacular) but for the sake of the band. Samantha, Suzy and Celestine are going with them, for heavens' sake. Does the Universal Records have an alternative security / escort detail they would contract if White Hats decline...? And is that detail competent?

As mentioned before, I don't expect high-end trouble on this job. Those are local bands, not Silverhand, Eurodyne and the like: I guess Universal Records' competitors would gladly scare the living shit out of them and take them over, rather than waste them. So - make our lives miserable with small acts of sabotage, maybe pay some punks (or a down-on-their-luck gang of nomads) to harass us on the way. But nothing to the caliber of threats we've seen with Mr. Tanaka* during his trip to Vegas.

* this being the 4th most popular surname in Japan, I'm using it as "generic Mr. Smith / Johnson, except he's Japanese".

8-Ball's Driving skills are Bike +2, Car +4 and Hover (chipped) +3, though with a high REF base of 12. It would be better to keep him as observer though, he has superior Awareness score.

However, I'd prefer not to have Mitzi on the same bike as 8-Ball. Too many eggs in one basket, if you catch my drift. 

The Bermuda has a buildt-in CB Radio.

Angel could even build a radio scanner (these things "spin the dial" by themselves) probably, but if the transmission is scrambled or in code, he has no skill to deal with it: cryptography and electronic warfare are outside of his area of expertise.

I'd suggest taking Mitzi's bike (the Long Rider) along, provided we can reasonably pack it into the van. Gives us a backup light vehicle in case we need one. Between it, the GevHog and Bermuda we would be able to move 8 people on light vehicles (and offroad, which the van isn't likely to deal with well).

As for gearing ou for the job, keep in mind we expect to earn ~3000eb per person on it. We have to avoid falling into the trap of spending more on the tools that we get from the job. Especially given we are expected to cover our own room and board (which, from my practice, is an uncommon arrangement in such a situation, but hey. That's how things are).

When I talked about San Morro sewer rats, I meant literal rodents  Consider it a tongue-in-cheek personnel equivalent of "everything but the kitchen sink"  Question is whether it is worth dragging Angel out of his basement. Having a tech on hand may be useful in any situation, but he has several fields of expertise that won't be much of use if he has no well-equipped workshop at hand. In general, I have a lot of problem with Angel, I just need to get myself together and discuss it with you, @Allen1

Oh, we're running into chain-of-command issue, too. Mitzi has declared that Suzy trumps 8-Ball when it comes to chain-of-command. 8-Ball's response that he's OK with that does stand, but this means Suzy will be both a part of the package being guarded, and commander on the ground. An odd setup. Mitzi's call, though. But one she has to make. 

Now, I guess we should take all the able bodies we have. There will be a lot of stuff and people to guard - 4 large vehicles, and how many band members, roadies and support staff...? If Jack Masters considers a competing records company trying to pull anything, we'll need  folks to watch out for anything strange. I don't expect the level of problems our last gig presented, but there are a lot of things a skilled saboteur may pull to harm the whole gig without actually resorting to full-scale attack or violence as such. 

The problem is - if we take a lot of people, the profit margin will be slim to none. Still, it is a company (White Hats') job, and this is Mitzi's company. She has to balance the books.

Camping and feeding the crew - if the bands are going to stay indoors rather than camp under the stars, I see no reasons why we should do otherwise. We need to be at hand if something happens. Trying to disentangle yourself from your sleeping bag and crawl out of your tent is going to take ages if SHTF. Jumping out of bed and kicking your motel room's door open is way faster.

Note: bring in enough sleep inducers to be able to give everyone access to one if needed. Especially if we take less personnel.

Vehicle-wise, I guess 2 bikes and the van (how many people can it take, assuming we're talking about several days on the road?) will do. Have 2-amn crew per bike, and the rest of the crew in the van (if we take too many people for the van, give each convoy vehicle an on-board guard).

That's a surprising take on it, honestly.

Let's compare it:

• Barrett-Arasaka Light 20: Accuracy 0, Availability R, range 450m, catalog cost 2000eb, ammunition 25eb per round*.
• Barret M-90: Accuracy +3, Availability R, range 1000m, catalog cost 1500eb, ammunition 15eb per round,
• 15mm Nomad Long Rifle: Accuracy +1, Availability P, range 900m, catalog cost 3000eb**, ammunition cost: undetermined.

* compared to the other two, caseless. So can't reload your spent casings (which is possible for the other two, assuming 15mm BRG is cased). Also, the ammunition is produced solely or almost solely (the beforementioned AE-47 case) for this weapon, so it has to be difficult to find, even on the black market (I assume .50 BMG turns up more often, as .50 BMG machineguns are pretty popular with military and corporate troops. Sure, MG ammo doesn't give you the precision of match ammo, but I prefer non-match grade rounds to no rounds at all!).

** And it comes with a number of add-ons like scope or solenoid trigger already. Also, Nomads may use their family connections to buy one cheaper.

So, yeah, should a down-on-his-luck punk run into a Light-20 just lying around (preferably with a full mag), he indeed has got himself a potent weapon... but the other two are just as lucky finds. And easier to keep running.

At the same time, cost of any of them is likely to be prohibitively high for most starting characters - unless they have unexpectedly deep pockets. But then again, why invest in a Light-20, if there are better choices available...? Sure, there might be legal considerations, but we're now getting into minor points of fluff that are campaign-specific.

• What is the exact personnel package we're deploying for that job? I mean, we could take everyone, including San Morro sewer rats  but I guess it is not what our employer intends to pay for. 

It is a tour security job, so we need our combat personnel. Having a medic or two is preferable, if we expect trouble. Samantha and Suzy are on the tour anyway. But who else do we need / are paid to bring?

• Vehicles. If memory serves me, there is team's van, Cossack's GevHog (if it makes sense for that application), and at least 2 motorcycles (Mitzi's Thundergod, if memory serves me, and 8-Ball's Bermuda... assuming Suzy & Mouse are done with it - both are offroad capable), before we count in Suzy's own Shiva. 

It depends on how do we want to handle the convoy on the road, but I believe being able to scout ahead would be useful (then again, we can do it with a drone). Having the van with an intervention crew as tail vehicle of the convoy sounds like a good idea too, and I would love to have another crew in front of the convoy (apart from the motorcycles). I'm afraid we don't have the manpower to do that, however. 

• Threat level. On the road, I definitely advocate rifles (due to their range). Will the 6,5mmH set be available by this date? During the gigs themselves, this such a show of force is likely to be seen as excessive, however, so we'll need second set of weapons, ones that can be kept out of bystanders' sight.

9 hours ago, Allen1 said:

I don't think that this round (15 BMG) is a type of sabot round as the damage (7d10) is way too much damage as the sabot 20mm round of the Arasaka Light 20 is only 4d10 damage and not close to the 8d10 damage of a standard 20mm round. 

I wouldn't put too much importance on it being saboted or not. 

My guess is the R.Tal crew didn't had detailed information about the Steyr 15,2mm back in the day, or maybe they've seen it more like Western equivalent to the Russian 14,5x114mm, just better suited to precision shooting (and, after all, being half a century more modern!). Of course, I might be wrong, and they were basing it off the FN BRG-15 (15,5x106mm). A similar weapon (also called BRG-15) is listed in Maximum Metal as ACPA gun.

Now, I always found Barret-Arasaka Light 20 a weird gun. It is described as being close to 2m long, rather heavy, using expensive, properitary ammunition (the only other gun using it is a chaingun mounted on the AE-47 helicopter in Eurotour, IIRC), the range is shorter than any other sniper rifle in the rulebooks, and it is pretty expensive itself. I guess (again) it was an early CP2020 idea of "making a high-tech Barrett Light .50 for the Cyberpunk age", as by the standards of pure 2020 rulebook, it is an impressive weapon. But once they have done the math for 12,7x99mm (aka .50 BMG), it turned out that 20/9mm Barrett-Arasaka cartrige looks pretty bleak in comparison. Which is why they slapped the "damages armor by 2 SP on each hit"  rule to it, trying to keep it relevant.

But I'm just guessing and voicing my opinions. For what they're worth.

Nomad Long Rifle and its ammunition is described as 80's tech, plus Nomads use cased ammo in general, for logistics reasons.

IMO there is no evidence suggesting it to be caseless.

My guess it is an offshot of the Steyr 15,2x169mm cartrige, and Steyr IWS-2000 gun.

Well, yes, about a year ago...

September 11th is OK with me.

I'm not going to be there on the 4th, however.

Ah. Okay, somehow I was thinking the sniper fire on the freeway was a, let's say, "regular" problem. OK, no problem there. In any case, if Nails needs our help, she knows where to find us (and while we had our run-ins with the federal law, Nails was okay). So 8-Ball would be ok working with her again.

War? Well, if you see a war, we have screwed it up already

 To quote a joke from the times past IRL, There won't be no war - tThere will be such a fight for peace there will be no two stones left standing!  

No, really. We have already been told - in no uncertain terms - that starting an open war with the Voodoo Boys won't end well for us. While we could thin their ranks pretty considerably in an assault (perhaps even win), we supposedly haven't yet met their combat sect - only their drug-dealing sect. But the cops aren't going to turn a blind eye on a gang war, or even totally-not-a-gang-war. 

Which is why we are considering clandestine options. Ones where it is totally-not-us, officer, I swear. Stuff that should be very difficult to trace back to us. 

Nothing particulary intelligent here yet, I was thinking about sniping at them from a safe distance. Pick them out one by one.

Won't be quick, but will be difficult to trace, including trace it back to us. It doesn't matter how many of them are there, if a silenced bullet / arrow / other vector comes out of the dark to take down one of them. As per sniper rules, we sneak out after the shot: no point making a stand.

We don't have to do it every night - even doing it for a few nights will have a disrupting psychological effect, and likely force them to expend efforts & resources to watch possible sniping positions. 

We could do it with a bow, or we could order a rifle - from Red, or from Angel (though in this case, it is a matter of having specs for him to start with. And he's having his hands full anyway). Even a relatively old hunting / sniper rifle (eg. Winchester M70 or Remington Model 700) will do fine (which is the reason why I have inquired about these being possibly purchaseable without much paper trail behind them. But I've learned that, well, tough cookies).

Of course, taking the shot and evading pursuit is one thing. The other is infiltrating and exfiltrating - repeatedly - without being noticed and traced back to the team. 

I had this idea of having trademark arrows (say, with custom fletching carrying some ethnic motive - to point suspicion to some group the Voodoo Boys have beef with already). Let's say I'm not so sure about it, though.

One of the problems I can see is Voodoo Boys never showing up alone. IIRC, the smallest group we've been told was observed was four of them. That is way more than we could take down in one fell swoop, as to be sure not a single soul escapes to tell the story. On the light side, however, this makes it more difficult for them to hide. 

For taking them all in one fell swoop, locate their warren and present the problem to Angel. His advice would be "pump it chock-full with sarin or mustard gas, let it stew for a few days". Definitely not a route 8-Ball would be willing to follow. 

Given there's already a sniper problem in the city (or at least on the motorway) at the moment, this might be a two-edged sword. We might be able to sell our activity as being the other sniper's... or have Law & Order on our neck because they think we are the other sniper.

...since we're at snipers: not gonna be big money (well, or any money) in this, but we might try hunting down the freeway sniper. Talk to our favourite Marshal (Nails, if memory serves me), or have Mitzi talk to her friendly cops, and see if we could get some starting info. Then take a good scope or two and try locating / identifying the freeway sniper, under a strict agreement with the cops we won't be engaging them: just track them down, and inform the law enforcement to do the actual realisation* .

Could earn us some kudos points with them cops: it shouldn't be perceived as exactly vigilante activity, as we're merely putting our skills into use to help the cops locate the suspect - not trying to dismense justice ourselves in any form. That, or Nails could perhaps have us deputized again.

We'd need some sensible spotting scope, and I guess a few pointers from our in-house snipers (since Sniper is one more skill 8-Ball would like to dab his fingers into, but wasn't able to, so far) on how to spot a sniper - and not get spotted ourselves. Oh, and time. Lots of time.

* local cop-speak for a high-profile arrest, forced search or another big-time bust... well, basically any pre-planned operation that involves a law enforcement tactical team.  

On 10/08/2021 at 04:25, TigerGuard said:

Also, if we use shotguns, tazers, drug loaded paintball and squirt guns then there is nothing really for the police to conclusively trace back to us.  

And bows / crossbows,too. Making ammunition for these should be relatively easy (both regarding skill and actual equipment), definitely lower-tech than with firearms (of course, quality of making remains important). Torsion weapons are also generally quieter than firearms (bows can use silencing weights on the string), they are naturally AP, and they have enough range (at least the more powerful ones) to allow firing from a distance. Not a sniper rifle, true, but good enough in urban environment: 150m. 

I'm not sure if ballistics experts could link arrows to any single bow - and besides, bows - as far as I know - do not require (weapns or otherwise) license to own. 

...which is why 8-Ball wanted to add bows / crossbows to his portfolio of weapon skills.

...of course, if he had a right type of sword to accompany a longbow, he could reenact "Mad Jack" Churchill. I guess it would give the Chrome Berets quite some reason to scratch their heads  Though learning to play bagpipes is something I'd consider going over the top there

I guess we should put together the shopping list Mitzi placed with Red?

• 4 Militech Dragon rifles
• 6 Militech Mk.IV rifles
• 100 magazines for these (total)
• 3500rds of ammo in 6,5mm Hybrid. with 60/40 breakdown mitzi asked for, this means 2100 AP rounds and 1400 DP rounds. IMO having what (in translation) is, basically, one "fire unit" of ammunition (equivalent English term seems to be "day of supply". Standard amount of ammo assumed to equal normal combat consumption - an estimate based on experience. in Warsaw Pact, for an AK, it was 300rds / 10 magazines equivalent) is somewhat optimistic. Our experience in Detroit implies much higher ammunition consumption on an op (and yes, this agrees with what I has taught about urban combat ops IRL: consumes a lot of ammo), and I'd absolutely hate to be left with empty magazines. Especially given we're using a specialized caliber, which may be in short supply anywhere we turn up...
• 8-Ball suggested some practice ammo so we could break the new weapons in. I'd suggest 1000rds of practice ("rubber") ammuniton, i.e. 100 per gun (some folks are already familiar with Dragons,some won't need much practice, but some might need quite a bit of it). And put it to use ASAP.
• assorted kit, like cleaning rods, rifle slings and so on.
• did she ordered these weapons already smartchipped? If not, Angel can handle this (but he'll need parts. And time).

8-Ball has also suggested Mitzi the company should get licensed for heavy weapons, precisely - grenade launchers, as they give us great flexibility. 

• Mk.IV can use either a 40mm underbarrel GL, or Militech 25mm pump-action GL. Both have their advantages, it would be desirable to have both types available, and take them on missions as situation dictates (switching them on a rifle requires a competent gunsmith's attention, but given there is a competent gunsmith available, it isn't a big deal).
• I'm not sure whether the Dragon can accept a GL, being a compact bullpup rifle of Cocealability equal to that of either GL. We need GM's call here.
• If technically possible, I see no reason not to smartlink the GLs too. The system should be rigged to the rifle's smartlinking (as grenades are way slower and have much steeper trajectory than rifle bullets, rifle's smartlink won't do on its own, IMO).

Just to explain why 8-Ball is using laser-sighted guns (mainly - handguns, he has warmed up to a smartlinked "mission gun"): the problem of transition.

To take advantage of the smartgun, you need to plug it into your interface socket. This takes a moment of your time. When you reach for your handgun, you usually don't have that time. You have to have the gun up, and start blasting away ASAP. 

On a job, it may look like it did in Detroit: at some point 8-Ball's FN RAL ran dry - and while he did intended to reload it next turn, a punk showed up and started blasting at us. 8-Ball was able to simply grab his handgun and blast the booster to kingdom come. No need to plug-in before doing that. No need to unplug his rifle first, either (he has a single interface socket...).

Now, there are ways of going around the problem - smartglove interface, like the one Hollow uses (but it is far from being foolproof, requiring a roll to properly align contact surfaces). Radio smartlink (from Chrome 1 - but you need a cyberaudio suite for it). Probably something else I can't recall right now. 

Sure, Smartgun is +2 to hit. +3, if you manage to add up cyberoptic / smartgoggles targeting scope option. Laser sight is +1. In 8-Ball's opinion, a difference that doesn't outweight the advantage of being able to just pull the gun out and start blasting your opponents without having to deal with any loose wires.

Of course, this is what applies to a handgun. A sidearm. Backup. When we're on a job, and we fully intend to get into trouble any moment, being plugged into one's primary weapon makes sense. 

As for the weapons stash - having deniable guns is a good idea, but on the other hand having an armory full of random stuff is not. So, we might want to keep some more stuff than I have originally anticipated, but still far from "all of it". Having a deniable handgun, rifle and perhaps shotgun (well... no identifying rifling on projectiles leaving these! Which is one of the reasons why 8-Ball likes to stick to his shotguns ) per team member would be great. Though it would be useful to stick to same ammo and preferably same weapon for everyone would simplify the logistics. 

Possible discardability is the reason why 8-Ball uses an Armalite 44 as his mission handgun, and FN RAL as mission rifle...

@ Angel's .44 lever action - we'll see how it goes. Sure, asking Suzy for another  favour is an option, but Angel is not too keen on owning too many favours, even to someone closely associated with the team. And so far, he owes two. 

The big trouble gun project - what I'm saying is the fluff interpretation I make of what you say. No in-game effect. Bottom line - won't be making it anytime soon.

I'd assume the "generic" 5,56mm to be some variant of the FN Minimi, aka M249 SAW. Fits the bill. And will serve till we can have a Renegade SAW (in 6,5H) in the armory.

@ 8-Ball - sad panda about the Microtech Blue Max. We'll stick to the basic smartlink then, and add other features as possible. 

As for the uniform - well, the proper thing would be a Colt 1911. But it would be going a little to far, so 8-Ball's carry revolver will have to make do. Going for a custom revolver holster resembling one that might have seen  on an US serviceman in that period. A true diehard reenactor wouldn't accept that, but 8-Ball has to make compromises. 

Regarding the weapons / cyberware stash:

• 8-Ball would like to have a look at the sword (not the monokatana) - he might decide to keep it for personal use. Though likely it is nothing really interesting, given it was lifted off a booster.
• He'd also like the H&K MPK-11 and the smartlinked Arasaka Minami to stay in the group's armory (not his own, thank you very much: he doesn't have room for an armory in his apartment! :P): they make for good weapons if concealability and sound suppression is an issue (though Angel will have to make appropriate sound suppressors for these).
• The Arasaka Rapid Assault shotguns as well. Good utility weapons in a limited distance combat.
• Keep the explosives (grenades and Claymore mine).
• A smartlinked Kalishinkov A-80 will do as Fawkes' rifle for the time being, won't it? At least untill we get to the Militech Dragons / Mk.IVs. In fact, keep all three as team-available mission guns untill we manage to switch to 6,5mm Hybrid rifles.
• Optionally keep the paintball guns and the Power Squirt. If we have spare room for them, and if someone can cook up / purchase (that is, Angel or Mitzi) appropirate, mission-specific loads on as-needed basis. These are highly specialized weapons.
• Same with the microwaver.
• Angel would like to have a look at the belt-fed machinegun. There is a remote chance it is a Militech M232 SAW, which is partly compatible with Mk.IV, and thus perhaps he could adapt it to 6,5mm Hybrid ammo. And for high-intensity situations, 8-Ball would like the option of having a SAW available.
• He'd also like to have a smartlinked Colt AMT 2000 and Kalishinkov A-80 set aside for him (he'll get an interface plug and universal link eventually - money permitting - and will use these as his mission guns). 

Apart from the above, I don't see anything my characters would consider to be worth keeping. So, unless someone else would like to keep something, my advice (because eventually it will be Mitzi's call. And professional skill) is to have the stuff sanitized by Angel (altered rifling, altered extractor / ejector for cased weapons, doctored serial numbers), and get rid of it. Start sanitizing with whatever we intend to keep, though.

Angel's personal projects: OK, noted. Definitely will be making the Winchester. And yes, with Picatinny rails. It's big brother remains as a future project. I interpret your opinion as Angel not being yet able to do the engineering math necessary for making the gun safe to use: he has a good idea how it should work (it will be even better once he fabricates out the .44), but given the pressures and energy impulse it will be generating, his math tells him that either it has to be beefed up and weight a metric ton, or that it will fall apart when fired - neither of which is acceptable. He'll do the engineering math, even a few times, and keep the results - but once he realizes he can't crack it yet, he'll let it go. For a time.

Also, the webbing project is a go. Once 8-Ball gets a wind of it (and let's be honest, there are few people in the world more observant than 8-Ball), he'll have a few ideas and custom orders for himself.

8-Ball's personal projects: OK, will do the uniform. I'll need a custom holster for it, though. One patterned after the WW2-era holster used for S&W Model 10 revolver, but made large enough to hold his Arno. Going out to a celebration in the park is no excuse to go unarmed (unless Chrome Berets clearly state they don't want any guns around). also, 8-Ball's account can handle paying for the driving test and registration, no problem.

As for Microtech Blue Max system: gosh, I thought we had it sorted already... It isn't listed in any of the books - I made it up, just as I made up the Renault Ibiza. All its components are listed - in Maximum Metal, Chromebooks and - in case of one additonal do-datt, in Interface magazine.

It is a vehicle-mounted minicomputer (Chrome 3) / smartlink (CP2020) that has:

• secured access (SmartLock, Chrome 1 - being a smartlink, it has to be plugged into to operate anyway, so this function verifies if you are an authorized user)
• autopilot function (Maximum Metal)
• high-end navisystem (Maximum Metal, they list it as "military navisystem". Though if you'll say it is available only with the lower-end "civvie" navisystem, it'll do).
• superior quality cameras (Image Enhancement - Maximum Metal) with Infrared vision (again Maximum Metal) ,rather than standard cameras that are a part of the smartlink vehicle package.
• Provisions for (civillian-grade) terrain-following radar and radar detector (Maximum Metal) 

Which I intend to supplement with:

• said (civillian-grade) terrain-following radar and radar detector (maximum Metal) 
• high-power headlamps (Maximum Metal) with IR-spectrum capability (Maximum Metal again this combines with IR sensors to efectively give the vehicle Active Infrared as per Maximum Metal rules), 
• neuraweave seat covers (Interface 1.3) to taserize the bejeeus out of anyone trying to ride it without proper authorization through Blue Max's SmartLock feature.
• Reinforced external loudspeaker. Should I want to make the entire street listen to what I listen, I could then plug a music chip into the minicomp, right? Or run it via smatlink off my Wearman Mk3. That is, unless I need to pay for audio system on top of it. Which, heck, I'd do.

Of course I fully expect it to cost me the combined price of al those systems as per their prices in respective handbooks. 

In terms of having data from all those systems visualized - well, if the neuralware Universal Link is not enough to cut it, that's one of the reasons I traded Cossack a set of Natiional guard armor for a smarthelmet - just tell me whether it'll need Video Imager or Times Square Plus in it.

Why the Microtech Blue Max, then? All those options are zero-space as per Maximum Metal rules, so there's nothing rules-wise that'll prevent them being fit onto a motorcycle. Being a complete package, it needed a cool name - and I believe it is more realistic to have it as a package, than as individual systems bought piecemeal. Since it is a package that does more  (as listed above) than your basic vehicle cybercontrol package is why I refer to it as "advanced smartlink". 

Now, if you feel the need to prune options out of it, well. GM fiat. I can live with it being just a basic smartlink, and buying some of the options listed separately & later. I just intended to make it into a cool ride

The Dangling Threads:

• Voodoo Boys. Yeah, 8-Ball wanted to go after them quite early. We were told this would violate the terms of peace between Voodoo Boys and our allies. I recall Mitzi being told - in no uncertain terms - that should things start happening to VB, we're going to be primary suspects. So there's that. 
• Blue Goo. We don't know much about it. Though it might be worth paying a visit to that ruined mall near 88th NCART station. In force, as if memory serves me, that's a pretty rough area, right?
• Ukrainian Mob: 8-Ball doesn't know much about it. Cossack has the cultural familiarity, while Mitzi knows how to deal with mobs... 8-Ball is absolutely willing to help his friends (hmm... his view on them - especially on Cossack - is somewhat more complicated, somewhere between "brother / sister in arms" and "family". People you don't necessatily always see eye to eye with, but whose well-being is a very important thing. Ones you don't leave hanging) on that, but how and where to start?

10 hours ago, TigerGuard said:

Fawkes has one item on his to-do-list -

Convince someone to give him some freaking weapons looted from either of our recent engagements!  I was pretty sure I had mentioned it at least twice while in Detroit, and now with all of these corpses laid before us I'm saying it again - I need guns!  Preferably a long arm, full auto isn't required but would be appreciated.  Thanks, you all are great......

There was a nice Kalishnikov A-80 with smartrig that 8-Ball brought from Detroit, and decided he doesn't need it. It went into White Hats stash. If Fawkes voices his concerns to him, 8-Ball will suggest talking to Mitzi about the piece. I mean, Fawkes has a prefectly legitimate need for such a gun, and 8-Ball will absolutely support his request. Not to mention, while they do not tend to see eye-to-eye, Fawkes is 8-Ball's new gym buddy (when 8-Ball picked up the issue of getting Celestine back into shape, she wasn't interested - but Fawkes was, so hey, the park and beach are ours :D).

There was some loot form the Punknaught, too, true. I'm sure we'll find somethig appropriate.

Plus, we had quite some discussion on standarizing on weapons (or at least magazines). While 8-Ball is not a fan of the Militech Dragon (if anyone gets the idea of asking Angel for his preference, it would actually be Dragon - smaller, lighter and more ocnvenient to carry. Angel somehow ain't shooting a lot), he absolutely could live with a Militech Mk.IV - which is ammunition and magazine compatible with the Dragon. Perhaps we should take this issue up with Mitzi. At current stage, White Hats could sell some salvaged stuff (what we consider we wouldn't need. Perhaps with Angel going over it and fixing any issues), and raise funds to start buing Militech 6,5mmH weapons - enough of them to equip the team. These will be registered as company's property, and thus could be legally used on company assignments.

Also, @Allen1 - I don't expect to find anything particularly interesting in the Punknaught loot (boosters, well, aren't the kind of folks to pack interesting guns. Usually.), but Angel would be definietly interested in what is in that haul. For scientific purposes, you know  He'd definitely want to lay his hands on some stuff, if he finds anything that makes even a remote sense... rather nothing worth keeping, but some might be worth examining.