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Everything posted by MonSTeR

  1. Yep I see this as an alternative. Can you explain how cumulative wounds would be dealt with? As well as wounds to different body parts?
  2. Well? Who actually knows? Is Apo-Stasis going to be the invention of a new system? Or is it a reworking of interlock with plug ins and add-ons? I asked before, but got no definitive answer... Can someone please stick this to the top for me so I can get an answer and then try to work towards the same thing as everyone else? Quote I get the feeling Joe and Chrys are on the same wavelength which is good, but I also think that if this is the definitive vision of what's going on here. (And it maybe should be as at least 2 folks are in agreement on it that the rest of us should fall in line...) That it might need spelling out in black and white as an announcement. I'm still presuming that we're all trying to re-work the existing system and background. But I've still not seen a synopsis that is clear as to what it is we're trying to solve.
  3. Quote (psychophipps @ Dec. 11 2002,20:26) Yeah, I thought so too until you people started busting off terms like, "wound levels", "roles", "pickup skills", and your personal favorite MonSTeR "body type modifier". Once these terms were being used, it became a reprint of an obsolete gaming engine and cyberpunk-genre RPG instead of a modification or redux of an existing system that can easy be tweaked for anyone's use without worries of copywrite laws and other legal mumbu-jumbo. But hey, what do I know? Mark(psycho)Phipps( HAHAHA! ) LOL - no, I mean I thought it was an updated version of interlock with the add-ons and plug ins?!?!?!
  4. I think the "original" cyberpunk vision was dark and bleak, just like the "original" sci-fi had us all living on Mars by now Things just don't move as fast as these films suggest. I think the "false" world in The Matrix is one of the portrayals, most in line with my idea of stereotypical modern cyberpunk . Everything for "normal people" is exactly how you'd expect, they wear their normal clothes and do their normal jobs, with the Edgerunners going all out on the cool clothing to co with their calm confidence in their own abilities. Heat has the look I try to portray in my games, normal clothes and blending in are the order of the day. Ordinary guys doing extraordinary things.
  5. Coffee cups clatter and folks grab jackets. Outstanding bills are settled and the team moves outside into the glare of the morning sunshine. Mirror shades had never been more appropriate. Relativity Aeronautics is run out of one of the many private hangers at Night City International Airport, so the team heads South-West braving the morning traffic. It could be a long drive.
  6. Quote (psychophipps @ Dec. 11 2002,11:30) While the basic dice engine is sound enough, I can't help thinking that we can simply tweak it a bit for our needs instead of trying to make a reprint of CP 2020 with a grip of add-ons and plug-ins. Mark(psycho)Phipps( HAHAHA! ) BUT I THOUGHT THAT'S WHAT APO-STASIS WAS ALL ABOUT ?!?!?!?!?!?
  7. Quote (freakboy6117 @ Dec. 05 2002,08:13) the driver may add half his vehicle Zen rounded down to rolls for manoeuvre and handling and the addition of full vehicle Zen skill to awareness notice and initiative rolls while in a ground hovercraft/hovercraft. When not driving said craft a panzer boy is out of his element; vehicle Zen only adds half skill level to awareness/notice and initiative rolls in this circumstance. See I never have treated them as baby solos. Ive always taken this to mean that when they're in a PANZER they're in their element, when not driving said craft, but still driving any OTHER craft, that's when they get the half level bonus, if they're not in a craft at all then they don't get any bonus.
  8. Oh and Chrys, yes I agree a "Listen up" style sidebar from everyone is definately the way to go on this, and in fact maybe MANY of the areas of contention, like say, combat sense.
  9. I think some of the tech stuff might need a good going over, not from a realism point of view in fact from the opposite. It's almost like it'll need "speeding up" to get the level of tech presented in RTal's stuff on the high streets by 2020.
  10. One thing that I am worried about is that fact that as skills get harder and harder to obtain (realistic) during character creation, it does limit the scope for creating interesting or fun characters (cinematic) I know that there probably isn't a perfect compromise here, but I can't help feeling that as the system gets tighter and tighter as we're doing here, characters will get more and more generic. Especially if we start basing, like I'd previously suggested, Special Ability on career skills, everyone's going to take the same "essential" career skills and as such, if we get too constraining, every character that is good with a computer is going to end up a level 1 netrunner and every character who's good with electronic security is going to end up a level 1 Techie. Ring any bells? cough level 1 mage cough level 1 thief cough I know we're going round in circles here, but I think it's the only thing we can do until we hit on a decent solution.
  11. Quote (Chrysalis @ Dec. 05 2002,12:48) This would make more sense then the classical problem with all the skills costing in character development 1 to 1, and in game play the 1 to 10 exp point ratio. which makes sense if your campaigns are over a short period of time. In the original description there is an amazing differance described between a skill 1 person (high-school graduate) and that of skill 4 (doctorate) -Chrysalis But that's only for the skill of education and general knowledge and isn't really reflective of what you get doing a PhD or a Masters, the point of those degrees isn't to give you and education and a borad general knowledge, it's to push your skills in your area of research. The +4 education and general knowledge skill would be like a fringe benefit, a literal 'pickup skill' of doing a higher degree. The actual thin you'd be concentrating on would be something like pushing you "botany" skill to +8 (which the rulebook states is the equivalaent of a doctorate in Botany) The rulebook also equates +8 in a skill as being the level required to teach that subject in high school (for both geology and history) There's little parity between many of the skills.
  12. That's right Joe, no Bioplagues, no mass drivers, no third world war (Bush is saving that till after Xmas) I usually run in a world that has very little change to how we are now, just like 1982 was that much different either. The technology is different, but people still go to work in the city in the morning and come home at night, eat three meals a day watch TV and have babies. Part of that is that I have to base everyday life in cp2020 on what I see on TV and the films because rural England is very VERY different from urban USA. But I don't think in truth the "real" future will be that different. The thing I think that will needa lot of detailing or fiddling even is the scientific and medical breakthroughs that allow Cyberpunk to have it's Cyberware by 2020. If we push the timeline forward much further it's loosing the cyberpunk and becoming sci-fi, if we don't backdate history a little, then we're going to be pushed for time to invent nanotech and have it on the highstreet.
  13. There's a proverbial train of waitresses ferrying coffees and pastries and donuts and anything else high-fat and high-carb that makes a good, if unhealthy, breakfast over to the team. The girls seem chirpy enough, probably because the grumpy customers don't come in till lunch hour.
  14. Character Points At the moment I’m in favour of having a “pay points” system of character generation. It makes things fairer across the group and also means that the level of the game can be controlled making it more fun for all players. The most difficult thing is balancing realism with fun here as it normally is. If it’s very hard for folks to actually have stats of 10 then it’s more realistic, but it loses some of the fun or accessibility of the game where players want to be “the strong one” or “the smart one” etc. GURPS has a graded scale of buying characteristics making it harder to get top level stats. In fact you pay more points to increase stats above average than you get back for dropping them below average. I personally think the linear scale, one for one, so Ref 10 costs 10 points and Int 2 costs 2 points etc. works best for “feel”. It lets responsible mature players (I’d hope our key demographic) create balanced and interesting characters, but also doesn’t prevent folks from going all “anime” and havng max-min characters either. Again I favour a lecture to the GMs reading the rules about the implications here rather than a crippling limitation on the rules. I usually use 65 character points. To represent “hero” types, not superheroes, but ordinary folks doing extraordinary things. Averages out at a row of 7s, with a couple of 8s or a single 9. Starting Skills OK the first thing Im gonna ask is … IS +10 THE HIGHEST LEVEL A SKILL CAN EVER BE OBTAINED AT? OK moving on Personally I think pickup skills are essential but not in the way that they’ve been used before. I think they should be representative of the everyday skills we all take for granted or will by 2020. (Assuiming the game is still going to be set then?) Everyone of “adventuring age” in a major city in the USA is goingto be able to speak a language. Or two. These will probably be English and then things like Spanish or Japanese or whatever depending on the racial background of the character. Then there’re skills like “Drive” which most folks are going to have in modern America I would have thought. I think there should be some sort of “civilian life” package that all characters get that’s independent of what other skills they get. I think Phipps had some listed out in his KISS system that we could have a look at. I think that basically we should aim for total skill points equal to Character points. If the characters are streetscum, with nothing then they shouldn’t have the skills to have made something of themselves, their own limitations should have kept them in the gutter. If we’re talking superheroes like say James Bond, then yes, lots and lots of skill points, making the characters not only world class marksmen but also Nobel prize winning scientists and caring, sensitive lovers. The skill system above seems to have tossed out the idea I had for basing a character’s special ability on their key career skills (like basing a solo’s combat sense on his 4 highest combat skills), I’m saddenend but hey these things happen . I’m very much in favour of limiting a character’s special ability to keep things balanced. To the game being played. What I call “superhero” games, where the characters are Medtechies like Dr Ross from ER who never ever lose a patient and who always get the girl or solos like James Bond who never gets shot, let alone killed, I think should have access to the highest levels of their roles’ special abilities. Normal heroes like say Deckard from Blade Runner are professionals and should maybe be able to get them at medium to high levels. Minor characters like lobby guards, shouldn’t have more than one or 2 points in their SA if any. Phipps once complained that as things are written in the rulebook “basic goons” have combat sense +5. He’s right, that’s CRAZY. I usually run “basic goons” as Solos yes, but with Combat Sense +0 that’s right zero. They have all the other skills but no special ability points. Yes they might be ok shots, but they don’t get the drop on the other characters all the time, it matches the power level of the rest of the game. Role Playing is group story telling nothing more really, and if the story isn’t fun. People won’t want to play. The story’s heroes should be able to get away with whatever’s appropriate for them and hav the skills to do it. If a big adventure for the PCs is knocking over a 7-11 for a bag of chips because they’re hungry, then give them 10 skill points total. If a big adventure for them is running round corporate head offices in a tuxedo with an smart-uzi and a monokatana and they’re supposed to win, give them 100 skill points. I think the basic level should be 60 skill points total. Including a replacement for pickup skills but maybe excluding their first language skill (say english +8) that everyone should get. With perhaps some restriction that say s that at least 10 or 15 of those points must be spent on “civilian skills” and give a civilian skill list like Driving, and Swimming and Paint/Draw whatever. Pros and Cons OK then next thing I want to bring up is the advantages/disadvantages system found in systems like Fusion, BESM and GURPS where you pay character points to get “non skill” traits for your character like ambidexterity and so on. Ocelot has a system somewhere on the net that detailed a system very similar to this and I’m wondering if it’s something folks want to get into? Personally I think it makes characters more unique, but also can lead to a lot of incredibly “unique” characters with all sorts of weird and wonderful traits. BUT having a system like interlock with a lot of detailed stats should reduce the effects of this as in systems with a lot of stats folks are less willing to sacrifice character points fromt their stats because each one is so specialised and thus any one can be important. If we were to straight “borrow” the system from gurps sort of thing I think a 1 character point to maybe 5 GURPS points would be about right. That’d need a lot of playtesting to introduce though. Wilphe said that Quote Note that however, low powered characters may be highly skilled and high stat characters may be inexperienced. and the system I’ve proposed above doesn’t really alow for that. But if as a pro/con thing, you could have a facility to make a character “highly skilled” as a pro, he could maybe sacrifice one character point and get 5 skill points or something? And vice versa, sacrificing 5 skill points for one character point? (arbitrary numbers not actuall figure proposals)
  15. Quote (Chrysalis @ Nov. 30 2002,18:47) I need to get back on Apo-Stasis, and start doing real work on this trying to figure out what actual conclusions have been drawn. But back to the question. I think one of the problems I see is that we have three choices: A) We create a D20 Cyberpunk. There are on-line already net-books on the matter, so we could have a look at already created material, and see what kinds of conclusions we can draw. We create the book on the basis of the old Interlock system. Not asking for permission to use the rules system is morally bankrupt, and therfore we should ask for permission. R. Talsorian has a long history of acceptance towards its fanbase, so getting permission once we have a draft to present is not a problem. C) We through out the old and create somehting new. This would be the best alternative, but impractical. At least I don't have the time nor the inclination of revising, reviewing, and playtesting new rules. If someone in the shadows knows a group of friends that are able to take all the ideas from Apo-Stasis lock themselves in a cupboard for two months and emerge with a new set of rules. Then absolutely. Playtesting is its own bugbear. -Chrysalis I think personally that is the only option here. with regards to A) Wizards already have D20Modern which will probably already have a D20cyberpunk supplement in the works, and I doubt we could beat them to that, especially one that we could a) all agree on and bear to bring ourselves to write for d20 C) is out of the question as we have a hard time agreeing on many of the facets of the game as is to come up with a set of rules to playtest. Then playtesting them with our various groups is more than likely going to show that the rules "we" wrote work for "our" groups and the rules the other folks wrote will work for their group but not for "our" group if you see what I mean. So I think we need to stick to what we're doing, reworking the Interlock system, keep the basic mechanics of the system, the stat+skill+d10 but hammer out the dents. Like maybe jury rig, or the pay based on SA level only and so on. We could probably use some cast iron bitchiness though, Chrys please cos at times us guys tend to just turn into a pissing contest for want of a better term and we could perhaps use an semi-independent overseer on some matters to help them get resolved
  16. 8 am the following day. The sun is up but low in the clear blue sky, lending a yellow tint to the horizon and the autumn weather is cold and damp, luckily that's not so noticable as Rat, Shrap,Thumper and Neko sit in the Starbucks coffee house. It's safe it's warm and it's anonymous. Bloodbath sees the team as he enters the place and holds up his hand gesturing for 2 minutes to get some hot java. There's a brief and friendly exchange between the old nomad and the teenage girl serving coffee. His friends notice him point over to their table and she nods. The big man wanders over to the table and sits down.
  17. Well I saw what could be construed as a near-as-dammit D20 CP on sale in my local games store this weekeknd. I think it was called "modern D20" and from a cursory flip through, it was cyberpunk D20. The character classes included one actually called "Techie" then there were "Bodyguards", "Gundslingers" and the like. It was a big professional jobbie, with great full colour artwork etc, so we couldn't compete there. As far as typing goes, I'm never sure of the spare time I get, but I've got a fairly good grasp of the English language including "correct" grammar. As for format I'm not keen on pdf, it'a pain in the arse of folks who have a dialup connection like a lot of the uk. BUT I also understand that it's agreat universally usable format and that HAS to be good The other format that it might be do-able as a CD? I don't know how much this would cost or what's involved. But instead of printing costs, maybe folks could buy a CD and prit it out at home? We could offer exerts on the net so folks can see what they're after, but to offer a stolen copy of it all free, is either going to cost someone bandwidth and money, or money for blank CDs? Idunno ?!?!?!
  18. The van drives into the night across town to Shrap's pad. The rain is coming down heavier now and can be seen in the orange glow of the streetlights and in front of the neon glow of the occasional signs scattered here and there. Top Jimmy turns on the van's windshield wipers, they squeak slightly as they clean away the grime and rain from the glass. Nine-Mill points out turnings here and there cursing quielty on occasions at the glare of oncoming headlights catches her full on. The rumble of Bloodbath's Harley can be heard from behind the van, the old nomad is picking up spray, but he's out of the worst of the rain not that he'd really mind, or feel it, anyway.
  19. If it's not too expensive I'd pick it up for completeness With regards to which sourcebooks are essential, I think that it depends greatly on what you already know and where you want your game to head and also how experienced you are as a stern GM, because GMing Cyberpunk is different to GMing ANY other game I can think of. The CP2020 Rulebook is all you really need to play. The first supplement I'd advise anyone to pick up is "Listen Up You Primitive Screwheads". the GM's helper guide. It tells you exactly what you already knew, but should hopefully give a GM the confidence to actually put that sort of knowledge into practice. The chrome books are all good imho they can add a lot of scope to your game. but some folks, like me, don't really think that full borgs by 2020 is a likely element and I try never to use them, just like powered armour. The world books vary in quality, the "net" books are both rather good, but for the physical world I think the Night City Sourcebook is the best, if you aren't sure about where to set your game this really is a gift, a complete ready made city complete with a big fun tabletop map OF the role specific books, I think Wildside is the best. It's got a lot of details about the "street" side of things that can be of use in most campaigns regardless of the roles played by the party members. I also think folk should try to pick up a copy of GURPS Cyerpunk. I think there's a lot of helpful hints and tips and the like , it's good for atmosphere and can provide a slightly different perspective from Rtal's viewpoint.
  20. Oooh jeez this is a great topic Check out THIS LINK for a selection of CP cinema classics discussed on RTal's site I think my top 5 goes something like... (and in no particular order) 1) Heat 2) Batman 3) johnny Mnemonic 4) Escape from New York 5) Blade Runner 6) The Matrix 7) Robocop 8) Predator 2 OK so that's 8. I couldn't really cut any of those out and I really feel like I need to add more. I might discuss them in a bit more detail if I have time, regardless of whether folks are interested or not
  21. With the rain still coming down and the night well and truly set in around the city, the group sets about making a move for a good night's sleep. Bloodbath has his Harley, and there's the van and a choice of who's sleeping where. It's looking like crashing at the techie's place and probably more chinese food too is the most popular choice. A trip to Relativity Aeronautics seems to be first order of business tomorrow, especially if there's some online assistance in the team's corner.
  22. MonSTeR


    That's the sort of think I'm on about Thumper I’m going to suggest 5 skills including the special ability for each “Special ability package”/”Archetype” this way it’d no longer be a role. Rockerboys/Charismatic Leadership I don't quite know if Rockerboys would need awareness though to get the charismatic leadership skill. Most Rockers I know are completely self involved I'd substitute awareness for Human Perception in their career skill list, letting them see how to work a crowd, whether the crown needs a ballad or a rocking number or whatever, rather than noticing the fact that there's a guy 4 rows back with a tribal scar on his face. Also being a rock star or a musician doesn’t mean you’re a Rockerboy. Rock stars could be musicians with no charismatic leadership but high perform or musician skills like play instrument. Likewise a teen star like Britney Spears would have the “Vamp” ability rather than the Charismatic Leadership skill stated for a Rockerboy So I’m going to propose these 5 skills for the Rockerboy archetype. Charismatic Leadership Human Perception Perform Wardrobe style Compose or Play Instrument Techies/Advanced Tech I think the “Jury Rig” special ability is ‘the broken one’ rather than combat sense. I’d propose substituting it for a different one, maybe something like “Advanced Tech” that would maybe work as a bonus to all other tech skills, or could be used in lieu of any missing skills, “Oh I don’t have AV tech but I’ll use my “advanced tech” skill instead”. OK I know that that exact description is not going to be a workable solution, but I think something to replace “fix anything for 1d6 turns” would be a good idea At the moment the rules I’m farting around with has “Advanced Tech” replacing “Basic Tech” but it can do everything that basic tech can do but shifts the difficulty level down one slot. Something that would be “difficult” with Basic Tech would be “average” with Advanced Tech. If you read the rules in Wildside on Streetwise vs. Streetdeal that’s the sort of thing I’m on about. I’m also going to suggest that you don’t get to be a real Techie without some form of at least semi-formal education or book learning, so I’d make Education a compulsory skill. The greatest real life Techies I know have PhDs in things like Electronic Engineering and the like. They don’t work in the local hardware shop. The 5 skills I’d propose for this role would be something like “Advanced Tech/Jury Rig” Electronics Education And then any 2 from the list below depending on the specialization the player wanted to take his PC in. Aero Tech AV Tech Cyber Tech Cyberdeck Design Electronic Security Gyro Tech Weaponsmith. Med Tech/Medical Tech I’ve always thought of the “Med Tech” role to be representative of someone who has some sort of formal medical training. As in medical school, or EMT training or whatever. It’s definitely one step up from First aid, and isn’t really something that you can pick up, especially not at the highest levels. Basically I’m assuming that a decent Med Tech skill represents Doctor or at least an MD in training, or one who never graduated for whatever shadowy reason etc. I’m going to assume he went to college, and medical school at that. You don’t get to go to a medical school without some prerequisite education in the sciences. And that’s what I’ve focussed on here. Again this is very biased from an UK perspective on what one needs to get into an UK medical school. The other skills a decent doctor would pickup would be things like Human Perception, to notice when patients are hiding things. Cryotank Operation to keep patients healthy on the way in. Teaching, if they want to lecture at the med. School maybe Library Search like Thumper said, if they want to write research papers, or they could go a completely different slant and take some combat skills to represent an army doctor etc… N.B I’ve left out pharmaceuticals from the list here, because the cp2020 rulebook states that it’s the skill governing the design and manufacture of drugs, not prescribing them. Med Tech Biology Education Diagnose Illness Zoology Solo/Combat Sense Here I think Thumper is right on the money. Being a solo is about killing them before they kill you. So the skills should be things like Awareness/Notice, coupled with your combat sense to keep you REALLY out of trouble. And then the combat skills. It doesn’t/shouldn’t matter which ones the player chooses, whether it’s a ninja style archery and martial arts sneak em up character, a balanced mix between armed and unarmed combat, a gun-nut, or someone like Phipps’ sensei who’s a master of 4 different hand to hand styles. The remaining skills could be things like “Wardrobe and Style” for a high profile bodyguard. Or electronic security and pick lock for an infiltration expert, or Intimidation for an enforcer, or resist torture/drugs and seduction for a James Bond style secret agent. Combat Sense And any 4 from Awareness/Notice Archery Brawling Fencing Handgun Heavy Weapons Martial Arts Melee Rifle SMG. Media/Credibility The master role list (from wherever it’s from, I just printed it out ages ago) has loads of Media roles, which is good, but I think usually a media character works best if he’s after an exposé, the investigative journalist type role. For no other reason than it’s perhaps the most “cyberpunk” in its nature. The sort of skills I’d go for in order to give a media character credibility are listed below. I think Awareness notice is to spot the clues at the scene, composition is to actual create the news report/exposé/documentary and education to actually get folks to give the character the “real world” knowledge. Credibility Awareness/Notice Composition Education And then one of Interview, Human Perception, or Library Search, depending on what sources the character will be getting his stories from. Either real people who’re directly involved the innocent bystanders or other documentation on cover ups and the like. They can then match the remaining skills to the other areas they want to focus their character on. A character that’s going to spend a lot of time around celebrities is going to need Wardrobe and Style and Social, one who’s going to uncover black market scams and slavery rings is going to need Streetwise. Netrunner/Interface I personally tend to handle netrunning very differently to how it’s portrayed in the CP 2020 rulebook. That means what I’d suggest doing for this role for my own games is very different to what changes I’m suggesting here for one semi-compatible with the CP2020 rules. Again, I’m not sure if awareness/Notice is a skill particularly “core” to a character whose specialty is sitting at a PC all day. Then again I’m no hacker, and if it applies to spotting aberrant lines of code or “glitches in the Matrix, it happens when they change something” then it should definitely be one of the career skills. I think I’d offer the suggestion that it’s the electronics and computers side that needs to be stressed rather than the education side here, after all look at that real world hacker “Kimble” 14 and hacking the NSA, not much chance of having a decent education skill at that age, especially if you’re into hacking rather than going to class. So maybe the following skills? Interface Awareness Programming System Knowledge (the rulebook calls it net geography) And either Cyberdeck Design or Electronics. Depending on whether the character will run from a PC type setup or a jacking in type Cyberdeck. I know that I tend to usually have folks using goggles/gloves or even a keyboard setup in my games as much as they use a jack. Corporate/Resources Welcome to the high life. Whenever someone mentions corp PCs in a cp game I always think of the film Robocop. Miguel Ferrer’s “Bob Morton” I think of as the stereotypical corp character. And that’s the sort of idea I’d push forward as the PC archetype. I’d say the primary skills were the following. Resources Education Stock Market Persuasion Human perception I’ve nominated these as an MBA from Harvard (education) is probably always going to be impressive on your résumé and help you climb that corporate ladder, I don’t think folks will trust you with a billion dollar project without some sort of business qualifications. Stock Market I’ve put as I think it’s the skill that best reflects the overall state of the corporate climate. Persuasion and Human Perception are there to reflect the fact that to be a corporate you need to get people to do what you want without them realizing it, and also to let you realise when other people are trying to do the same to you and set you up for the fall. I’d also say that some familiarity with whatever corporation you work for’s realm would be useful so skills like Accounting or Library Search or Expert _ would be useful. And of course it’s not the smarmy back stabbing world of the literary corps without the skills like Wardrobe and Style, Personal Grooming and Social Fixer/Streetdeal In my opinion one of the hardest roles to quantify. I think it’s a dangerous role, more so than that of the solo, because for a solo, you expect trouble. As a fixer you’re never sure when a deal is a deal or when it’s an ambush sort of thing. Being another “front line” role I think that Awareness/Notice should being the archetype’s core skills. Persuasion is next on my list of needs for obvious reasons. I’m not sure here whether the combat skills should be necessary in order to have streetdeal, they’re useful, yes, but I figure as long as a fixer has a trusted bodyguard he might not need them, and the more directly related skills to streetdeal might be things like accounting or intimidate and human perception. So I’m gonna propose these 5 skills… Streetdeal, Accounting Awareness/notice Human Perception or Intimidate Persuasion Nomad/Family Ok, I’m never sure what the role of the nomad is in the general scheme of things as t applies to the CP game. I’ve always seen them as second rate solos with cooler cars. Sorry but that’s how I see it. I think to be a high level nomad, you’re going to need to be a diplomat not a driver. Keeping the pack politics on the level and making the best decision for the group. Family I’ve always seen is the ability to drum up completely loyal footsoldiers. “Don’t worry, my pack can lend a hand” type affair. One of the best characters I even GMed for was a nomad who really never used his family special ability, it’s almost wasted skill points, it should be background not a skill. Do folks see where I ‘m coming from? But anyway to have a high “Family” Special Ability I’d say the skills needed might be, Family Leadership Human Perception Oratory Wilderness survival. Panzerboy/Vehicle Zen and Aerojock/Aircraft sense Since the “Shockwave” supplement came out with the revised Panzerboy role I’ve often thought that a Vehicle specialist would be a better role for the parties driver than “nomad”? Or at least one that should be included in the core rules. Why? Vehicles are cool, they’re fun and they are abundant in the 21st century. Plus the CP genre has so many cool new types, ospreys, panzers zeppelins, not to mentions cars and bikes and trucks. I’d go for some slightly redefined Special abilities though. I’d make Vehicle Zen apply to all ground and ground effect vehicles, ie ones designed to be piloted in 2 dimensions. (left/right and forwards/backwards) I’m not quite sure what I’d have it do though, I’d probably suggest that it is exactly like Combat Sense, but that it only applied when the Panzerboy was driving a car/panzer/motorbike whatever, not when he’s in a plane/AV, or on foot. He’d get a bonus to his initiative, letting him nip in and out of traffic harmlessly, and be able to spot gaps and trouble spots hundreds of yards ahead. The question I ask is should it add half it’s level to manouvering rolls as it does right now? I’m very tempted to say yes, but feel this could be unbalancing? It’d also take a lot of play testing. I’d do the same for Aerojock and the “aircraft sense” which is a dumbass name for a special ability imho, don’t know what I’d call it instead though. I’d also want to add a new archetype straight out of the GURPS rulebook, that of “expert”. When Joe was starting his Cthullupunk game I thought “how cool would it be to play a kinda of Indiana Jones crossed with Mr Giles from ‘Buffy the Vampire Slayer’ type character?” One that was steeped in lore and book learning but who was now venturing out into the real world. But there’s not been a cp2020 role for that sort of character. At all. Ever. In Stormfront they had the only “expert” role I’ve seen in CP2020 that of Marine Biotech. They gave the character Medtech as it’s special ability!!! Which as someone who knows a fair bit about marine biology I thought was bloody rediculous, Just cos I can isolate a gene from a fish doesn’t mean that I can take out someone’s appendix (well not do it an have them live anyway ). So with a very open system we should have roles that don’t really have special abilties too maybe, ones that could use plain skills and not need “special” ones. Perhaps if a character has no special ability they can just treat their career skills as 40 more points of pickup skills. They have a lot of time put into the skills they choose, but they’ve never been formally trained in the area needed to get abilities like Medical Tech or Streetdeal or Combat Sense, they’ve always just ‘made do’. This would give those players who want to a completely open character generation system exactly what they want, but coupled with the above rules governing special abilities it’s keep folks from having a huge combat sense and then a bulk of completely unrelated skills. The other point I’d want to raise is should all the special abilities require you to have, as I’ve suggested, 4 other closely related skills to get the SA or should some cost more than others? I initially proposed the 5 skills per special ability package as a way to instantly allow “dual class” characters. Someone like “Han Solo” form Star Wars could be an aerojock/fixer he’s chosen 10 skills, and has met the career needs for both of them so he can have 2 special abilities. OR….Should there be a fuller list of the skills that can give you one of the common special abilities? Like a list of say 20 skills that a corporate could have and he’d only need any 5 of them? Or should ANY skill be on offer to all classes? Or should the roles be more limited than I’ve suggested here but less strict in the CP2020 rulebook? E.g. There are the “core 5” skills including special ability for each role, and then a list of say 10 or so “extra” ones from which the player can pick for his character? Should it be restricted to just 10 career skills total and HELL !!! should it be 40 skill points? And so on. Anyway that’s a HUGE post
  23. I'm afraid I come down on the side of the "no" You thought BTM was bad, wait till you get a load of a level 42 solo with a +3 magical Uzi I've only really glanced at the D20 system in all truth, but that glance was enough to put me off buying the latest edition of the Star Wars rpg. Yes I know most new roleplayers see nothing wrong with the D20 system, but converting the game to that system is about the LEAST cyberpunk thing that could happen So I say, if we're doing this to make a marketable product that might even make a little money, then yes, we need to go D20. If we're trying to make it into a game to bring players over from D+D to the cyberpunk game genre then yes go D20. But, If we're actually after something that has the tech-noir feel of cyberpunk and still tries to maintain realism, then yeah we need to keep it the non-level, skill based system that cyberpunk always has been. I think Thumper's right, Cyberpunk has always been a niche market, and Apo-Stasis could be to D20, what CP2020 was to Shadowrun. No it won't have the huge corporate backing, no it won't have the advertising in magazines and the like. But if it's kept Interlock based, it might just stand a chance of being "a game, for gamers, BY gamers", instead of "a game for beginners, by game designers".
  24. MonSTeR


    Ok, blame this particular can of worms on Thumper Basically I know we've hammered out the roles debate before but for old times sake and the Apo-Stasis project, let's do it again OK where to start? My opinion I guess Well basically I'm in favour of roles. BUT I'm not in favour of having character classes. If you can, I suggest you get a hold of a copy of GURPS Cyberpunk. In the roles section of that book it says what character attributes/skills/whatever are useful for that particular role and gives text decriptions of a lot of different types of the same roles. The same goes for the BESM supplement, "Hot rods and gun bunnies". Lots of description of the various roles appropriate to the genre without any cast iron character classes. I think that if we get the description of the roles down/borrowed/whatever, and then we write suggested skills to take rather than saying ALL solos have these 10 skills and ALL Medias have these 10 skills it'll give folks plenty of scope to see the sort of roles that can be played as opposed the the characters classes which must be played.
  25. Snow Crash is perhaps my favourite Cyberpunk novel, I love all the little touches such as the "doggies" and the Ng's converted firetruck/vietnamese office VR. Oh and I also developed a crush on Y.T. when I was reading it
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